South Carolina Police And Lawmakers Are In A “Shootout” Over Carrying Guns
BY Herschel Smith
7 years, 6 months ago
Law enforcement officials and anti-violence activists are blasting a state proposal that would allow South Carolinians to carry guns — concealed or openly — without a permit or any training, saying it would endanger police and the general public.
“It would create opportunities for additional violence to occur,” said Greenville Police Chief Ken Miller.
Greenville County Sheriff Will Lewis said in an email that he supports a resolution by the South Carolina Sheriff’s Association endorsing training for anyone who wants to carry a concealed weapon and opposing changes in current law.
Supporters of the bill, meanwhile, are returning fire, claiming that so-called constitutional carry, or open carry, would cut down on crime.
“States that have put open carry into place have seen a reduction in crime,” said state Rep. Phyllis Henderson, R-Greenville. “They’ve not seen an escalation in gun violence.”
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Miller, the Greenville police chief, noted that the measure is opposed by both the S.C. Police Chiefs Association and the S.C. Sheriff’s Association.
He said the proposal could lead to more police confrontations with people carrying guns.
“So now everybody is authorized to carry a gun, and guns tend to draw out other guns,” Miller said. “It will create opportunities for police shootings or for police officers or deputies to get hurt more.”
When guns are right at hand, simple arguments can easily escalate, resulting in tragedy, Miller said.
As for Miller’s argument, he’s lying. He doesn’t really believe that or he would take weapons away from his own officers because their interactions escalate and guns draw more guns.
No, here is why Miller and the other LEOs don’t want this. As we’ve seen before, it’s all about the money. They’ve even said so for us all to see. Follow the money. It’s money and control, but this is redundant.
It’s about brand new Dodge Chargers, fancy comms gear, new AR-15s, body armor, and jobs for people who would otherwise have to go find gainful employment in the real workplace.
Fortunately, the current Governor, Henry McMaster, supports constitutional carry.
S.C. Gov. Henry McMaster Friday endorsed a bill that would allow South Carolinians to carry a concealed firearm without a permit.
“Governor McMaster appreciates the House’s hard work on this bill, believes it is constitutional and will sign it if it reaches his desk,” said McMaster spokesman Brian Symmes.
Signing the pro-gun bill would appeal to gun advocates who vote in the 2018 Republican primary for the governor, when McMaster will be seeking a four-year term.
The proposal, sponsored by state Rep. Mike Pitts, R-Laurens, calls for what often is referred to as “constitutional carry.” The bill would allow those who legally can own a firearm to carry it concealed without a government-issued permit.
It also allows for open carry, which means weapons holders could carry their firearms on their person for everyone to see. The law still would bar carrying a firearm to prohibited locations and while committing a crime.
The S.C. House passed the plan last week, despite objections from some representatives that that House Republicans pushed the proposal through without debate or public input.
With four weeks left in the regular legislative session, the bill still has to make its way through the S.C. Senate before it can go to McMaster’s desk.
However, Democrats in the Senate — where individual members have more power — still could block the bill.
It’s difficult to know if his support is temporary, knowing that he will get elected and then be able to jettison the very gun rights advocates who helped him get elected, or genuine and legitimate heartfelt support. But at the moment these are his words. Of course democrats can try to block this legislation, and republicans might use that as a stalling tactic.
Either way, if republicans and the governor really want this bill, they can get it, and we all know that. We’re privy to their games. The governor can refuse to sign anything else until this bill is brought to his desk, and the republicans can shut down debate just like the House did.
But be careful. If this turns out to be yet another false flag event to appease gun owners like in the past, we will know. And we never forget. Just ask Larry Martin about that. Remember that while the debate about whether this increases or reduces crime might be an interesting sidebar – I can tell you since I live in a “gold star” open carry state that LEOs will be embarrassed and humiliated by their opposition to this just like they were in Texas when they see the statistics – this isn’t about statistics.
This is about God-given rights. Choose wisely, gentlemen.
On April 17, 2017 at 11:21 am, Bill Mullins said:
If memory serves, it was the Sheriff in Spartanburg who told people to buy guns because the police CANNOT protect them. I doubt he was part of the group fighting constitutional carry.
On April 17, 2017 at 12:59 pm, JohnMc said:
As much as I am FOR open carry provisions I do believe it wise that people get trained. Just knowing the law as to what is justifiable discharge of a weapon and the surrounding circumstances is worth the investment. You may have defended yourself but that can still land you in jail.
On April 17, 2017 at 1:01 pm, Herschel Smith said:
Billy, you mean Chuck Wright. Yea, he’s recommended folks in Spartanburg County buy and carry guns. That’s of course not the same thing as defenestrating the old guard laws where the CLEO had to give approval of the moral character of the individual carrying the gun. But it would indeed be interesting to see where Wright stood on this issue.
On April 17, 2017 at 1:48 pm, Pat Hines said:
Both the Greenville PD and the Greenville County SD are controlled by the Judeo-Marxists in Greenville itself and the Mauldin nexus of carpetbaggers and scallawags.
What we need in South Carolina is a state constitution provision prohibiting any government agency from any input on laws that have obvious conflicts of interest for them.
The same should apply to university presidents and officers that campaign against campus carry of self defense tools.
On April 17, 2017 at 8:17 pm, Paul Bonneau said:
“It would create opportunities for additional violence to occur,”
This may actually be true. But it is also at the same time the case that it would create opportunities for additional *defense* to occur. Since we already know that arming citizens reduces crime, we can confidently predict that arming more of them will reduce crime (on net) even more.
The real factor here is that cops, the people running the protection racket, care more about keeping their racket going than they do about the welfare of ordinary people. The more people are armed, the more they handle their own defense issues, the less they need cops.
CC permits performed the function, of demonstrating that the sky would not fall if the people were armed. They were good for that purpose; but we now face the question of whether people need permission from bureaucrats, to defend themselves and their families. Clearly, unless we are slaves of the ruling class, we do not. Draconian penalties simply for carrying without a permit, a paperwork “violation” at worst, make no sense at all.
On April 17, 2017 at 8:22 pm, James said:
One cannot legitimately call is “constitutional carry ” unless all folks can carry,the 2nd in bill of rights makes no mention of law abiding/past history ect.,keep criminals in jail if dangerous but otherwise unless I need a special decoder ring for bill of rights all in society can/should carry.On a side note,am not a felon/judged mentally insane(friends might argue I am!)ect.,just feel we either follow the bill of rights or we do not,no exceptions.I unfortunately see the bill of rights fading very fast in the govt.s eyes in this country,more reason then ever to fight for the bill of rights,or,natural rights as some call it.
On April 17, 2017 at 11:39 pm, Publius said:
So far 15 states have done this and one of them Vermont has never infringed upon the law of the land. It seems all the doom sayers are wrong with each state it has been passed in, and I cannot think of a better way of forcing the out of control law enforcement (civil servants) to behave in a civil manner towards the people whom they serve.
On April 19, 2017 at 10:35 am, Jerry Beckley said:
We should be aloud to pack guns. Guns don’t kill people, it’s those with the guns. Only honest people can be stopped from having guns, criminals can get them when they want, from the black market, and their the ones who are really doing the killing. I think concealed guns should require permits, to show that those people have received some training . But I also think when we buy a gun, there should be some training, before it can be bought.
On April 19, 2017 at 10:57 am, Larry Rhodes said:
The United States Constitution Second Amendment OVER RIDES law enforcement desires (what do they want a police state?)!!!! As a retired police officer with over 30 years of service, I understand law Enforcement concerns, HOWEVER, their concerns should focus on the CRIMINALS illegal ownership and use of firearms, NOT the law abiding citizens!!!! Law Enforcement and the government MUST enforce the laws on those criminals convicted of using firearms in COMMITTING crimes (ie: use a firearm in commission of crime MANDATORY minimum sentence of 15 years without possibility of parole or time off for good behavior)!!!
On April 19, 2017 at 11:33 am, George Rambow said:
If Law Enforcement goes against legal carry. Replace the Policeman Officers that are against the Constitution. Plain an simple. They would appear to have there own agenda, and they do not seem to understand that they can not be where you are when a bad situation accures.
On April 19, 2017 at 12:35 pm, Keith Boardman said:
“It will create opportunities for police shootings or for police officers or deputies to get hurt more.”
Nonsense. The people who would “hurt” police officers or deputies already carry weapons without a permit to to so.
On April 19, 2017 at 1:18 pm, Howard Taber said:
At the age of 16 I was carrying a .45 as a Military Policeman. Did so for several years and none of the weapons ever jumped out of the holster. Even facing a man that had a knife and said that he was going to kill me. Realizing that he was intoxicated I dealt with him and didn’t either one of us get hurt. When watching COPS on TV it appears that most are afraid of their shadow. Of course they may just be following a script.
On April 19, 2017 at 8:13 pm, Frank said:
Law enforcement officials and anti-violence activists are blasting a state proposal that would allow South Carolinians to carry guns — concealed or openly — without a permit or any training, saying it would endanger police and the general public.
“It would create opportunities for additional violence to occur,” said Greenville Police Chief Ken Miller.
Greenville County Sheriff Will Lewis said in an email that he supports a resolution by the South Carolina Sheriff’s Association endorsing training for anyone who wants to carry a concealed weapon and opposing changes in current law.
Supporters of the bill, meanwhile, are returning fire, claiming that so-called constitutional carry, or open carry, would cut down on crime.
Take care people who believe in self defense!!
This is a backdoor way of finding out who might carry a weapon.
NOT WISE!
On April 20, 2017 at 12:57 am, Robert Freddie:Lain said:
I live in a state, Wyoming, that if you can own the gun you can carry it how ever you want. We have a very low crime rate. It is a foregone conclusion that every car that has a Wyoming plate on it,it has a “GUN” in it…..
I, most of the time carry concealed, but do carry open. The sheriffs department and all of the deputies in Sublette County know this. I have also invested a lot of time and money in training. Have about 80 hours tactical rifle and pistol from the best shooting school in America, outside of the United States Marine Corps and The United States Army, which are the best in the world and that is GUNSITE ACADEMY in Paulden Arizona and about 300 hours from a firearms instructor in Vernal Utah.
I know of one instance when I was in Idaho, which is open carry state, I prevented a robbery because I was carrying ope. The clerk told that the two men that walked out had been hanging out for about 5 min waiting for the store to empty. As soon as I and my wife walked in they left. So may be we helped.???
I believe every one should have some training, but that should not be a per-requisite to carry.
On April 21, 2017 at 12:09 pm, MaddogDD said:
If there is so much concern about Training, why not build and staff Public Ranges for all citizens? If we can build golf courses, swimming pools, etc. for “the public good”, why not Ranges?
And Public ammo, too. 1000 rounds per citizen per year, for Training.