Grand Jury Indicts Mark And Patricia McCloskey
BY Herschel Smith
4 years, 2 months ago
ST. LOUIS — A St. Louis grand jury on Tuesday handed down indictments against Mark and Patricia McCloskey, charged in July with brandishing weapons at protesters outside the couple’s Portland Place mansion.
The couple was indicted on felony charges of unlawful use of a weapon and evidence tampering. The indictments were filed under seal Tuesday. St. Louis Circuit Clerk Thomas Kloeppinger said a judge ordered the indictments suppressed but Kloeppinger didn’t know the reason.
The grand jury added a count of evidence tampering after the Circuit Attorney’s Office in July charged the McCloskeys each with one count of unlawful use of a weapon — exhibiting.
The McCloskeys’ lawyer Joel Schwartz said he didn’t know specifics about the charges but said he’s not surprised a grand jury indicted his clients.
“I’ll certainly be interested in what was presented to the grand jury,” said Schwartz, who plans to request a transcript or recording of the proceedings, if such records were made.
And there you have it. Done in secret, without defense, and evidence only presented by prosecutors.
After seeing the pictures of what happened, anyone with half a brain cell would have been able to entirely dismiss this whole issue.
But no. They found enough ignorant rubes to go along with their scheming.
We had this conversation before about grand juries. Grand juries have their defenders. Great and glorious thing, they are, with good, street smart, common sense folks on the juries, it was said. And I said this.
Most of America cannot do basic arithmetic, or basic physics, much less solve algebraic expressions, or … God forbid … do calculus. Most of America cannot construct coherent sentences and have no more than 2 to 3 minute attention spans.
Most Americans cannot name the first three presidents or explain the roles of the three branches of government. More than half of America voted for a corrupt communist named Hillary Clinton in the last election.
There may be some juries who happen to get it right, but in the main, I distrust juries (criminal and civil) as much as I distrust the Grand Jury. And no, your umpteen experiences with a jury don’t matter one little whit to me.
One example should suffice (I could give many more). A former colleague (and fellow professional engineer) was interviewed by lawyers to sit on a jury for a case involving elevators (who knows, maybe someone was suing Otis Elevator for whiplash or something).
The lawyer asked him, “Do you believe elevators can fall for no reason at all? To which he responded, “No, there will be a reason – mechanical failure of a component, failure of a circuit, or failure of something to cause the event. A formal root cause analysis could identify why, and give us a root cause or multiple root causes, but no, nothing happens for no reason.”
He was dismissed, and the lawyers went on until they found an entire jury who believed that elevators can fall for no apparent reason.
Grand juries … pfft.
And to their defenders because of the trustworthy, ordinary, common sense street smart folks on grand juries.
Pfft.
Ignorant rubes. Suckers. Tools.
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On October 6, 2020 at 10:21 pm, PubliusII said:
Jury nullification, when/if it comes to trial….
On October 7, 2020 at 2:28 am, Nosmo said:
It’s becoming apparent that the only survival technique that will reliably – but not unanamously – work in a social environment is to surround oneself with one’s true peers.
That may be possible for small groups, but consistently fails as groups (aka “society”) get larger. It’s fuzzy, but I remember something about optimum village size (“social unit”) in developing areas maxxing out at around 150 members; once it grows beyond that competing philosophies (aka “diversity”) begin obscuring the mission of the social unit (village) and the resultant strife destroys the social cohesion that makes the village work. That just seems to be the way humans are wired.
I need to find that book again and review it, but I can’t think of a way for a complex interconnected social and economic human structure to operate without steadily increasing, and conflicting, multiple layers of regimentation, and even then, it forces fragmentation at the edges which interfere with the stated goals of the group.
The McCloskeys happen to be one of those intolerable edge fragments: they, under one particular established regimentation layer, elected to protect their property and lives; an entirely different regimentation layer found such action to be reprehensible, so money will be spent (lawyers) to manage the intersection of those conflicting layers (I hadn’t thought of “lawyers” before as “human Application Program Interfaces” (APIs) before, but it seems that’s their purpose – translate one regimentation layer’s instruction set into recognizable instructions a different layer can use to operate within the operating system structure). If the API functions properly, the conflicting regimentation layers will reach an accommodation, probably unsatisfactory to both layers, but in some fashion, workable without crashing the system.
Until the next time.
I don’t know what the solution to all this ingrained conflict is, or that there even is one, but I understand where, historically, it has always ended up.
On October 7, 2020 at 4:15 am, Duke Norfolk said:
Of course there’s that little niggling fact that these people are getting what they deserve for having supported who/what they have supported over time.
That and the fact that we are rapidly sliding further and further into a post-Constitutional time. Rearranging deck chairs…
On October 7, 2020 at 6:08 am, Matt said:
There is a book by Thomas Chitum in which he describes red flags indicating a slide towards civil war and conflict. Ethnic courts were one of those flags. This case is effectively the same, as is the Rittenhouse, and other cases where there is selective prosecution involving BLM, Antifa, and other forms of Brownshirts. It’s a delegitimization of the courts and people need to wake up and realize this and act.
I agree that there are few things scarier than a jury, and Herschel isn’t the first fellow engineer I’ve known to express these types of sentiments. However, I believe the intent of the grand jury was to put the prosecutorial power in the hands of the citizenry and not the State. Sadly, a stupid and apathetic populace has allowed them to become nothing more than a tool manipulated by the State.
On October 7, 2020 at 7:10 am, MN Steel said:
It gives me chills learning over 165 million people voted for immediate civil war, while somewhat fewer voted for later war.
On October 7, 2020 at 8:01 am, Ned2 said:
This is just grandstanding by the DA, and the attorneys just scored five times the fees to defend these two. Maybe a larger amount if they counter sue.
Our legal system at work.
On October 7, 2020 at 10:41 am, William said:
The bar for citizenship is set way too low, as reflected here. The founders had it right, but the downward spiral of this country began with universal suffrage, and I’m including the universal voting by men as a great mistake (and not even mentioning the female vote).
On October 7, 2020 at 10:46 am, John said:
Grand juries are the mustard on a crooked prosecutor’s ham sandwich.
On October 7, 2020 at 10:48 am, Frank Clarke said:
@Duke Norfolk
“…we are rapidly sliding further and further into a post-Constitutional time.”
Alas, we have been living in post-Constitutional America for about 155 years.
On October 7, 2020 at 12:27 pm, Bones said:
Last time around, I offered a defense of the Grand Jury system. This is the antithesis of that. All abuse, all the time. Wherever there is a Soros backed prosecutor, or a Mike Nifong type, (remember him?), you’ll find such abuse. The American Criminal Justice system presumes ethical actors, it can’t exist without them.
I believe that the McCloskey’s will either be found not guilty or win after appeal. But the cost of such defense will be staggering. A friend who faced a similar situation called it “economic guerrilla warfare”. It is. It’s also a warning. Toe the line, don’t defend yourself against our pets, or you will face the consequences. See also: Michael Flynn, Minneapolis cops, George Zimmerman.
Also, I see a lot of Civil War discussion above. From my time in Special Forces, I believe that we are in the place just before things go kinetic on a wider scale. (They’ve been kinetic in certain areas, not widely.) Anti-government underground organization(s) are flexing their muscles in order to gain converts or to neutralize antagonists. They have subverted public institutions, (like the St. Louis DA’s office), and will attempt to widen their efforts.
We can turn things back, we did with the anarchist riots in the late 1800’s – early 1900’s, with the widespread communist recruitments and subversion in the 20’s through the 50’s, and finally the insurgencies in the 60’s and 70’s, (Weather Underground, Black Liberation Army, etc…).
The difference this time might be the widespread acceptance by the populace of the basic tropes of the subversives, that America is flawed, racist, unfair, and in need of their brand of “Justice” in order to fix things. In the times described above, most people probably disagreed with the subversives, now who can tell?
On October 7, 2020 at 1:12 pm, Herschel Smith said:
@Bones,
“Wherever there is a Soros backed prosecutor …”
Yes there is that. But you’re too easily letting the jurors off the hook, as if they’re some sort of children who can’t think for themselves.
Actually, they are. Most Americans today are simply children who can’t think for themselves.
On October 7, 2020 at 1:16 pm, The Dark Lord said:
Grand Juries are MUCH worse than trial juries … nobody gets kicked off a Grand Jury for bias since the defense doesn’t have a thing to do with a Grand Jury …
and a Grand Jury hears a slanted one sided presentation of the case …
as the old saying goes … you can get a Grand Jury to indict a ham sandwich …
On October 7, 2020 at 1:22 pm, The Dark Lord said:
Grand Juries are often 16-23 people and for an indictment, and usually, all that is required for an indictment is 2/3 or 3/4 of jurors … so even in the worst case of 16 jurors and 3/4 required to indict, you could still have 4 jurors who don’t think an indictment should be issued … and one would still be issued …
On October 7, 2020 at 2:16 pm, Paul said:
As Vin Suprynowicz noted, “Voir Dire” is a French term meaning ‘jury stacking”.
The system is made by and for the ruling class, not for us. Not for justice.
On October 7, 2020 at 6:30 pm, Matt Bracken said:
Among other missed risk factors, the McLoskey’s should have understood “the CW2 Cube.”
They are white millionaires who “gentrified” and rehabbed a century-old mansion, investing a fortune of their own money to help “boot strap a mixed income and mixed racial urban area.
Big mistake. With CW2 looming, everybody needs to move to their own safe corner ASAP, or they will pay a hard price. It will be hard enough in your own tribal zone. As a hated [in their case white] minority embedded among an angry majority, there is no chance..
http://westernrifleshooters.blogspot.com/2010/07/bracken-cw2-cube-mapping-meta-terrain.html
On October 8, 2020 at 1:47 am, Unknownsailor said:
All the Mcloskey case proves to me is that if self defense against the criminal element becomes functionally unusable due to the decisions of the county DA, then the county DA is now part of that criminal element, and should expect no forgiveness, and no quarter.
Do you all know who your local DA is? Have you vetted the funding of their election campaign? Do you know their prosecution history?
I have vetted mine, he is Soros money free. In fact, I was surprised how little his campaign cost, about half the cost of a new car, and he financed half of that total himself.
On October 8, 2020 at 10:53 am, ApoloDoc said:
It isn’t just the local area such as the McCloskey’s experience. The entire “justice” system has been corrupted. DAs & their underlings exist ONLY to prosecute, most seem to care nothing for truth. Indict a ham sandwich? Yes. I have personal experience with such events, and have utterly lost any faith whatsoever in our political system & in the majority of the populace.
I DO have total faith in the Sovereign God who orchestrates all things for His Glory. Holding on to this is about all that sustains me, although support of friends has been one vehicle He has chosen. We (as a nation) have turned away from Him so dramatically, it is rather obvious that we are experiencing a chastening, a consequence . The idea that we can murder over a million unborn each year, that we can utterly ignore His design for human sexuality in marriage, that we can so corrupt most elements of occupation & economy, that in essence we utterly deny Him AND EXPECT NO CONSEQUENCE is absurd. This is the position of the atheist (whether consciously so or merely practically so) and His Hand is upon us. Lord PLEASE be merciful towards us!
Ultmately TRUTH will prevail, but not necessarily in this life. Lately I have been reading a series of books on church history (great writing by Nick Needham) and am reminded of the wretched evil that exists and that He permits, but that will one day be put to an end. Not in my lifetime, I sadly realize. But EVENTUALLY.
On October 8, 2020 at 9:31 pm, Sanders said:
Either the mob destroys everything you ever worked for, or the DA takes everything you ever worked for and puts you in a cage to boot.
So that puts folks in the position of nothing left to lose. A man with nothing left to lose is truly dangerous.